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TOPIC: [TTT Suggestion] Rule change

[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1284943

Server name: TTT server 1

Suggestion Title: Rule change

How it would benefit the server: Some rules are needed, they make the game more fun and reduce the amount of chaos caused by players in the game, however, some rules are susceptible to loopholes or abuse and in their current state, can negatively impact the game. Today I want to talk about this -

"2.6 Valid KOS Reasons - Ignoring unidentified bodies/C4 etc."

The C4 part of this rule is fine and we don't need to talk about that.

Ignoring unidentified bodies is suspect as you could have easily been the person to kill them or your T buddy could have killed them, however this rule NEEDS to be CHANGED. I am not 100% against this rule because it makes sense however I do believe in its current state players can easily abuse this by killing players left right and centre even when they didn't see the body. It also makes things very complicated for staff and players in game because the only way to prove that you didn't see said body is to record it, something that not all players do, making it really hard for staff to punish people correctly and as it has happened more than once, players are getting away with relentlessly gunning down other players and then claiming that they saw a body.

I think the rule needs to be redefined to prevent players from just shooting other players willy nilly. There is a similar rule in place right now where when a player kills another you have to ask them why they did it before killing them, so why should it be any different for this rule? Of course, if you are reading this and have a better suggestion for what we can change this rule too then please leave a comment of what you think.

Potential issues/exploits: The whole TTT staff team NEED to communicate to each other about this rule, that way we can put it in place so that there are no issues/exploits.

Additional Notes: N/A

FireLord Ozai
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Last Edit: 3 years 5 months ago by FireLord Ozai. Reason: Spelling

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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1284945

Yeah I can get behind this	Kessi_ Offline Fresh Boarder Jazz Pianist Posts: 89 Thanks received: 24 Karma: -11
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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1284947

One would need to keep in mind that there's always the possibility of someone simply walking over a corpse without identifying it in which case the rule makes perfect sense, however, as among us had thought me some people can be absolutely blind. We've had people walk over corpses before without noticing them or reporting them, that is, mind you when the game is built around the characters being in high contrast of the background (in most cases)

Why talk about Among Us in a TTT suggestion, well, quite simply put. If people can miss highly contrasting bodies which causes a giant button on the HUD to light up they can quite possibly easily miss an unidentified corpse that's stuffed in a corner somewhere (or anywhere else for that matter). And indeed, as you described it is difficult to prove in most cases (again there are exceptions) who has or has not seen the body and I could not think of any system that would be foolproof to check it either.

I do in the end agree the specific example of "unidentified corpses" may best be removed. It does appear like a huge flaw that relies on something that is almost impossible to prove. And let's be fair, to save and then upload a video within a round to prove your innocent really does not work (not to mention if you were to do it that way you'd just see the text "innocent" right there on the screen).

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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1284949

I agree, rdmers could 100% use this as an excuse for killing random players and getting away with it; as it is required that the 'victim' or the 'reported' has to provide video evidence; to proof if the 'victim' did in fact walk past an UNIDed body.
The only way i can tell if its a 100% BS excuse is if there are no UNIDed bodies on the map at the time. (by counting kills vs bodies found in the logs up until the report)
But what can you do about the problem?Make a system that logs when a player looks at an UNIDed body? Redefine the rule to include: "You must call out the UNIDed body in text chat, before killing the player who walked past it."?Redefine the rule to include: "You must have video evidence to kill a player who walked past an UNIDed body"?

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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1284950

	Poltergeist Offline Expert Boarder loud ghost Posts: 1256 Thanks received: 497 Karma: -37
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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1284951

Report-wise this issue happens way too often. People can use "you walked past an unid'd" in reports to avoid getting warned for RDM, and they do frequently. Some kind of change to the rule would not only benefit staff but also prevent people from being RDM'd.	Ubarberet Offline Senior Boarder Posts: 334 Thanks received: 209 Karma: 3
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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1284952

Kessi_ wrote: Yeah I can get behind this	Sir Kribban Offline Legendary Member Posts: 628 Thanks received: 400 Karma: 5
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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1284957

rule breakers use this all the time when they get reported	jam Offline Gold Boarder o/ Posts: 2709 Thanks received: 1409 Karma: -330
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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1284958

Please don't add another rule that won't allow you to shoot anyone without asking.	Tom. Offline Legendary Member Posts: 876 Thanks received: 420 Karma: 10
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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1284967

The rule itself is fine. If you don't have the evidence to punish you don't punish. Removing that rule with cause a lot of chaos. People already claim the " didnt see it " changing the ignoring bodies is rather your own consern as its awareness when playing. As a T communication and awareness is key.	Kurze Offline Legendary Member Expect me to be straight to the point. Posts: 2234 Thanks received: 1040 Karma: -30
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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1284973

In my personal opinion slowing down the game is never a good thing. If you're absolutely blind and don't see it as an Innocent then what's the big deal you didn't lose anything important and if you don't see it as a T it's on you for not communicating with your teammates and being generally aware of what's going on. In my 400 hours of TTT I've never once had a situation where I didn't see the body so I don't think this change is needed.

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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1284978

Interesting Stuff [ Click to expand ]

Have we really gotten this far? You cant really compare a game like Among Us (which costs 4€ maybe and that literally every fucking dumbass is playing, because he saw someone on stream play it) to a Game mode of a game that is old as fuck and has a considerable less player base than the other game? Even then you cant really compare the games, because the public matchmaking in Among us is the most retarded thing I have ever seen in my life. Legit every game I have seen someone play in public Among us ended up fucking retarded. In most cases it goes like that. You either have a group of friends that is just ghosting, some retards that blame random people and people not paying attention. I have never seen this much of stupidity in TTT and I have played TTT for over 7 years now and have around 2700~ Hours in Gmod. Its never been this bad and yet you sit here comparing the games saying that because of what happens in this one game we should change it in this completely other Game where this has never been a problem.

Other thing, I don't agree with the rule change. In the 2 years I have been in this community I have never seen a big problem in this rule. Of course sometimes someone gets killed because of this, but I have never encountered any big problem with anyone. The most I had was someone was angry for a round and then forgot about it. It is legit not hard to move your mouse around a little to look for an unid body.

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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1284979

Tom. wrote:

Please don't add another rule that won't allow you to shoot anyone without asking.

I agree that this is not how the rule should be changed, which is why i hope the whole staff team can talk about this issue, I merely suggested some change, but something like this will take a lengthy discussion to get loads of ideas through before it gets changed, i made the post to bring up the rule as an issue because it is very easy to abuse

FireLord Ozai
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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1284980

I'm not sure what's wrong with this rule, as the staff member can just check in the damagelogs wether the person that killed someone over not identifying a body actually identified the body themselves after killing a person over it.	Red. Offline Legendary Member ✨✨✨ Posts: 1212 Thanks received: 719 Karma: -129
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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1284982

The point is, its happening more and more where players are gunning down multiple people a round or at least multiple times across many rounds and if this keeps happening and getting to be a bigger issue, then more and more people will leave the server, I dont know when you have last played but some players now abuse it and it needs to be changed in a way where they cant	FireLord Ozai Offline Junior Boarder "I do have the power.. All the power IN THE WORLD" Posts: 117 Thanks received: 63 Karma: -2
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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1284983

Red. wrote:

I'm not sure what's wrong with this rule, as the staff member can just check in the damagelogs wether the person that killed someone over not identifying a body actually identified the body themselves after killing a person over it.

You must have misunderstood, people are killing other players for bodies that they may or may not have seen, but there is no way to prove that they have seen it unless they are recording, this allows people to kill other players who may have not seen it, then they get killed and report people for RDM because they killed another innocent and then they will get reported and warned, not the person who is abusing the rule

FireLord Ozai
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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1285009

FireLord Ozai wrote:

The point is, its happening more and more where players are gunning down multiple people a round or at least multiple times across many rounds and if this keeps happening and getting to be a bigger issue, then more and more people will leave the server, I dont know when you have last played but some players now abuse it and it needs to be changed in a way where they cant

Well thats their problem ngl. Its not that hard to just look around a bit and look for bodies.

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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1285217

Warning: Spoiler! [ Click to expand ]

From reading your comment, it is quite obvious to tell that you do not have knowledge of the rules, or TTT at all, which I didn't expect coming from you, considering your comments are usually well-written.

The flaw of your argument, as Nepgear mentioned, comes from the fact that you're comparing a chaotic clusterfuck of a "murder-game", Among Us, to a very well-refined and old Garry's Mod gamemode, TTT, which has many, many different situations, rules and laws, one of which is the fact that walking over an unidentified body gets you shot.

Among Us is a party game without any real rules, its focus being trying to figure out what the hell is going on and it is vastly different from TTT. Of course there will be people that stand on a corpse, not reporting it, ending up in them getting thrown out, probably upsetting them (and instantly leaving, like everyone does). Well, why does this happen? Because they're new, and there's literally no official information about how you're meant to play, as the playstiyle comes from the playerbase itself from unspoken rules.

TTT, on the other hand, has pages of rules, information threads and so on. It is a completely invalid and weak argument that "a new player might pass an unidentified body without knowing they'll get killed for it", as the very first thing you should do when joining a gamemode/server you're unfamiliar with (I'm sure this is known to be true globally), is read the rules. Even if they are completely new to Garry's Mod and have no idea about how servers work etc, the server constantly reminds players in the text chat about the rules, which they can access via "!rules". Doing so would have given them plenty of insight what gets them KOSed and what doesn't. It is, indeed, the player's fault if they fail to do a very basic and simple action, which is identifying bodies, therefore there is no reason to change a vital rule because of new players that don't read rules. Be sure to play on the server sometime, get familiar with everything and you'll know how much changing this rule would damage and straight up break TTT.

Do not be insulted, but this is, by far, the worst argument I've heard about why not identifying unidentified bodies should no longer be KOSable.

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Last Edit: 3 years 5 months ago by Davidov007.

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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1285297

Don’t you dare compare my baby to Among Us.	Jim_Jam Offline Former Community Manager TTT is my child ❤️ Posts: 8585 Thanks received: 3491 Karma: -32
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[TTT Suggestion] Rule change 3 years 5 months ago #1285302

The problem isn't the rule it is the trigger happy people who use every chance they can to get a kill, when I play the game I will always evaluate the situation and try to figure out if the person who left the body had any connection to the player's death before taking their life, as I am aware of how annoying it can be to sit there doing nothing cause you missed a body.	Sally Offline Forum Administrator Can You Understand How Strange It Is To Be Alive? Posts: 6988 Thanks received: 3528 Karma: 59
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