TOPIC: [TTT] McOxygen's Warn Appeal

Name - McOxygen
STEAM-ID - STEAM_1:1:39514038
Staff Members Name - Eddie
Punishment Reason - RDM - Do not join gunfights
Server - Trouble in Terrorist Town
Story/Situation - The short story is that I clearly saw Eddie shoot a guy first shortly after round start, shot him then I started shooting him. Since he didn't fire back and went to ID the body that made me confused. Just to double check I checked the body and finished him off. Eddie did ID the body which made no sense to me. Here is the screenshot of the logs.
Extra Information - As far as I know this isn't RDM nor did I join the gunfight.

handling

well, it looks like you did ardm to join a gunfights and then were unsure and checked after, nonetheless you still joined a gunfight

Listen dude, I get that you joined the gunfight and stopped yourself after realising, but you still joined the gunfight and actually shot me 3 times before you stopped. Your only excuse while you were in-game was that it was an accident, but you still broke the rules.

Wait no you didn't ID the body i'm dumb.

As far as I know joining a gunfight means joining mid gunfight. You clearly shot HIM first since I was there the whole time. No one in their right mind would ID a body after seeing someone shoot first. But you confused me and I had to double check just in case, that's when I finished you off. If you look at the logs, I didn't shoot you before you had killed him nor while you were shooting him. Don't blame me because you made a mistake as a Traitor and just straight up shot the guy shortly after round start.

McOxygen wrote: Joining gunfights does not have to be mid gunfight, if you have read the rules, which I'm hoping you did as you are ex staff as you said, you would know that you need to wait for one body to be identified before you kill a person, and you shot at me before I even had time to ID

Depends on a lot. If you saw him kill bosscomic as well then yeah you can 100% kill him. As for him killing the other guy, if you had been following hey im adam from the very start of the round so can confirm that he had committed no traitorous acts then i would also say you could kill eddie, but this cannot be confirmed by only the logs. It looks like what happened is you shot him then stop to let him identify the body, after he identified it as innocent you then killed him. Which would be joining a fight as without further proof he could have had DNA on hey im adam.

@Eddie wrote: I shouldn't have even stopped, I waited for the outcome, he didn't fight back since he seemed AFK anyway. Your fault for shooting someone shortly after round start in the open and expecting not to get killed as a result. How is that RDM in the first place?

Miia wrote: When I killed BossComic I was up at the tester, I then ran down towards the tower where I killed the other guy, and where he joined the gunfight

McOxygen wrote:
This isn't correct.

Joining a gunfight doesn't simply mean it has to be when two players are actually fighting each other, while it's more so the fact that it was an ARDM | Joining gunfight, and the RDM itself is technically acceptable due to the fact that the body was ID'd and proven as an innocent, giving you the full right to finish him off.

That being said, you shot him moments after he had killed him, thus not allowing him to actually properly ID the body before you attempted to kill him. If he had ran astray to avoid it that's one thing, but the situation itself is pretty clear. You shot him before allowing him to actually ID the body, which is ARDM, then when the body was ID'd and his kill proving to be an innocent, you were justified in killing him. If you'd like, this can be changed to ARDM | Joining a Gunfight, however the punishment and act are perfectly acceptable.

@Eddie wrote: If you had read the rules, which i'm hoping you have as you are staff you will see it reads as follows, "If two individuals are fighting and you have no proof which could be the traitor, you must wait before joining in the fight until one player dies and they either; identify the body/the round ends/you question them." As this is the rule a body does not always need to be identified, as if you have proof that one player has not committed a traitorous act/is proven, you dont even have to question them in this situation.

McOxygen wrote: He was not AFK, he was shooting back but missed. I'm guessing when you used to play there wasn't a joining fights rule. It would not have been RDM if you shot me after seeing that the body was innocent, but you didn't you just shot at me as soon as he died, without ID'ing the body first

Miia wrote: Miia is completely right, but this also means that you need to have proof of them being a traitor to the point of where you would be legitimately in the right for calling a KOS, beyond just suspicion as at that point it would still be considered as RDM as you would be Killing on Suspicion.

An example would be if a Detective or an Innocent that you know is proven "Either by Killing a Traitor or by getting Tested in the Traitor Tester" and they were shot by another person who cannot be confirmed, regardless they're proven and anyone attacking them would thus be committing a traitorous act.

Miia wrote: What further proof would I need after seeing him straight up just turn towards the poor guy and just open fire on him. It is my mistake for not killing him straight away after he killed him, for a second he went backwards thinking he wasn't seen. I was looking at him the WHOLE time. When you see someone sniping from the tower, you're standing next to him. Do you stop, go over there where he sniped a guy, confirm he's inno even though he just got sniper by a guy from tower out of nowhere or do you shoot the guy then and there?

Miia wrote: So you're saying that just because you don't see someone commit a traitorous act for a long time, that means they are definitely not a traitor, um what?

McOxygen wrote: Depends if the guy that sniped him makes any effort to go ID the body

@Eddie wrote: If you have been watching someone from the start of the round, followed their every move and thus know they have not committed a traitorous act then you can kill anyone who shoots them, as they are either a traitor or an rdmer.

Miia wrote: Oh alright, got you

stalker