TOPIC: [TTT suggestion] Punishable staff members

Server Name: TTT minecraft 24/7

Suggestion Title: Make it so staff members can be punished for rdm and such with a slay

How would it benefit the server: It would decrease the frustration generated from staff and users being on unequal footing

Potential Issues/Exploits:
None
Additional notes:
Literally every reputable TTT server I have played on before joining zarp had the same rules applying to everyone on the server. If a staff member broke the rules they would get punished accordingly. When I first started playing on zarp I remember being super confused about staff not getting slain for breaking rules.

If a user makes an honest mistake and falsely kos'/rdms someone and the player who made the report doesn't forgive them, they will get slain and most likely warned.(depends on the staff member)

Now if a staff member makes the same mistake, it will be brushed off as an "honest mistake", which it is.
Both admit making a mistake, but only the user will be slain for RDM

The only way to deal with these kinds of situations is to make a demote request/ report abuse, which I don't think really fit. I don't count making a mistake as abuse or worthy of demotion
I do realize that accumulating report abuses on a staff member about accidental rule breaking will end in demotion, I just don't think this is the way to go.

And lastly, my understanding of why this is how it is is because staff are supposed to be the role models of the servers and seeing a staff member getting punished would seem bad.
The truth is, staff getting slain just like everybody else really doesn't affect the authority staff have from a users point of view.

If a staff member rdms they should be reported if they do it multiple times..

if they rdm they shouldnt be staff

If a staff member is breaking the server rules they can be reported to higher ups etc and be reported on the forums and be brought up in the LTM.

It's like you didn't even read the suggestion

The point I'm trying to make here is staff aren't robots and they do make mistakes from time to time and I think it would be fair they get punished for mistakes the same way users do

Of course you don't fucking see a proper staff member doing shit like prop flying, a false kos or rdm every once in a while is what you're going to see at most

Gin wrote: Perfectly reasonable suggestion +support

just get proof of the rdming and report it to a lead team

poogle wrote: Just say something that hasn't already been said.

This is perfectly reasonable people make mistakes it happens they get slayed so users don'gt get upset about inequalities.

If a staff is a rulebreaker rather than accidently breaking a rule yes get proof and report it

Well if its an honest mistake that they have owned up to and apologized for then they shouldnt really be slain anyway depending on the situation according to the staff ethos.

Minor breaking of the rules or honest mistakes shouldnt be met with punishments just with guidance.
Of course it depends on the attitude of the reported player and staff interpret things differently.

But rare honest mistakes which a player admits to making with a positive attitude shouldnt be punished
If a staff member abuses their power and constantly breaks the rules then you should report abuse. Same can happen with honest mistakes but a LT would likely treat the staff with a verbal, as another staff would treat a user with a verbal in the same situation.

Slaying a staff member for honest mistakes doesnt really benefit anyone. Probably would cause issues between staff members too.

Nay wrote: Couldn’t have put it better myself.

Nay wrote: Well put

Nay wrote: Problem is this is never the case you're gonna get warned regardless of mistake or not

As far as I remember when I was a staff and training people I would make it clear to the mods and admins that if it was a minor mistake and they seem apologetic enough then to give out a verbal warning just to be more careful. If you think that the punishment is to harsh for the crime you can always make an appeal on the forums. As far as I remember the LT kept a report of the accepted appeals people made for the forums and action would be taken if someone had too many appeals for their warns

If a staff member RDMs they should be reported to higher-ups and the appropriate action will take place. Although in most situations it will be a simple talking to where the staff member is told to be more careful, the reports do add up. If a staff member has multiple reports against them then action will be taken.

They are there to keep users on the server in check and the powers they have help them to do that, they shouldn't, and will not, be using them on themselves or eachother.

Idk if anyone even listened to the suggestion but what he means is that it's annoying that u need to report them on the forums and wait until the staff meeting for them to be punished and what he means is that like every player gets reported and gets taken into a report chat and so should staff if they get !reported and they should also be taken into that chat and not some bs where u go to the forums it's unfair for the players that play ttt everyone should be punished for their mistakes and not say in the report when u deny it I WARNED HIM AND IT WON'T HAPPEND AGAIN SO(NAME) WILL NOT BE PUNISHED FOR THEIR ACTIONS
That's some bs
Make
It
A
Rule
We all have the right to get punished and so should staff!
MAJOR

People are making some good points, but I think people are missing the main point here. It'd level the playing field and it'd be overall more fair, specifically where Gin mentions this

Gin wrote:
THAT is the absolute truth, and it shouldn't be that way. A staff memeber can take a small smack on the wrist, a slay and a warn in chat. It absolutely doesn't matter that much. Make him sit out one round? A user does it, we should too. When I was staff, this was one of the most awkward situations to be a part of:

A rookie comes on the server, honest guy just trying to game on his real gamer hours. Gets shot by a mod, on his T round, because the staff member Was 100% sure that he was the T, but was a little wrong. I've been apart of those situations dozens of times, which is regrettable, but looking back at them they're statistically unavoidable, just, the planets line up and you're SURE he's the T. And he wasn't. So, the obvious happens, you kill him, he reports you, you open up a report chat and tell him that a warn won't do much, if you think what I did was bad you can request an abuse report on me or a punishment request or what have you in the forums, yada yada.

And then this happens. This happens like 80-90% of the time that situation takes place:
"So you can just RDM and nothing happens to you?! Because you're staff?!"

They don't understand the behind the scenes process that takes place and, realistically, they don't give a shit about it neither. They just want to see some justice, and it makes it honestly look that the staff member gets to walk scott free after RDMing. And plus, if he is a rookie, he most likely doesn't have a zarp forum account, and can't be fucked to make one, let alone figure out how to make a proper report with the template, wait for it to go through, only for it to be most likely denied.

Back to the topic. What this would do, a staff member sitting a round out, is make it seem a lot more humbling and relatable, but above all REMOVE TENSION. DE-ESCALATE. His anger would be over, as most peoples are after they get RDMed and they see the person who RDMed them get punished for it. Staff are players too, they should be able to be evaluated on their PLAYING as well as their staffing. Staff shouldn't be invincible to that. because it really doesn't matter to sit one round out for the satisfaction and better community opinion of a player. Players are the priority, and you have to look at things from their point of view, as there's always 2 ends to a stick.

TL:DR: Slaying a staff member isn't a big punishment : a slap on the wrist just so the tension between him and the player get lowered. Honest mistakes happen. Getting slain would remove tension and make it more relatable for the user.

Gin wrote: But uhh, people don't always get punished for honest mistakes. Verbals exist, you know? If a staff member is always slaying+warning users for honest mistakes (for example, if they're new) they're not a good staff member.

If staff members started punishing other staff then it would cause many problems.

A user wants a staff slain and the staff dealing with the report rules it as not RDM and the user will claim we are biased

A user wants a staff slain and the reported staff is convinced that he didnt RDM creating animosity between the two staff
members

Users can take advantage of it. Theres nothing stopping the user reporting abuse on a staff member even when they slay themselves

There are many situations like this which will disturb the game and will give staff another thing to look out for.

The report abuse section is there for this very reason

Nay wrote: Beleive it or not they can punish themselves

If theres only one staff on then they would have to. But then again, they will be called biased for not slaying themselves etc