TOPIC: A Legitimate Question

How was this fair?

I'm sure some of you know the behavior of the admin Cardigan of late like how he said this to me in my profile:
http://i.imgur.com/E2HSVJF.png?1

And how he said this to admin Sarah:
http://i.imgur.com/E8jzB3z.png

I put up the ban request for him since saying something like this that was highly unprovoked to someone is no way for an admin to behave, and he only received a tier 1 warning from Zart. Keep in mind he told me he wanted me to die and that I was a disgrace to my family and friends.

I'm sure this thread will be highjacked by Cardigan's friends and Cardigan himself, but if you can spare it, I'd like just unbiased opinions based upon the facts that were presented in the demotion thread: Do you think this was fair? What would you have done?

More here:
http://zarpgaming.com/http://zarpgaming ... ic.php?t=1

:EDIT:
In addition, what do you guys think of the demotions just for joining Scottie's community? Personally, I think that's a bit childish (Unless the staff that joined SD said they were leaving ZARP or started abusing). If anything it does nothing to help bridge friendship between the two communities. I was demoted simply for that, even though I've been a silent and neutral third party in all this, and I've done my job as well as I needed to for months.


Disclaimer;
I am not starting a staff war, I don't want biased opinions from either side. I respect ZARP and SD, I joined and took a moderator position there for my own personal reasons, but I never left Zarp, I still frequently play on its servers and have never condoned these mini wars between the two communities.

I am an unbiased third party based around fact not favoritism.

Hello.

I want to thank you for raising the issue and speaking up, but the thing is - given his actions he was given a verbal warning. That's lucky - Tier 1 warning? I would have complained on behalf of him to be honest, because that's not valid proof.

He was spoken to about his actions outside of ZARP. I agree that he went over the top, but everyone has their moments.

The thing is - it's always been practice that we can't handle peoples actions outside of our jurisdiction - even staff members.

And as I told you, as much as it's evident that it is Cardigan - provoked or not, it's hard to prove it is him. I could easily pose as you, it doesn't take a master of disguise.

The action taken was lucky. You should be happy that it wasn't just shunned and the actions would continue. He was informed that he was out of order - and he now knows. So the correct action to actuate him to act professional was taken, without letting one of our most dedicated admins go.

Since you rarely play the server, you will not realize how vital, and I can not stress - VITAL it is to have such fantastic management, not only in times as difficult as this - but whenever. Cardigan would be my admin of preference if anything important needs doing. His performance meets and exceeds criteria and expectations, and just because of some provoked mishap that relates to another community that it isn't our job to DEAL with - we would not waste that.

I'm not promoting nor saying that he was right in what he did, I'm saying that it's been dealt with - in an efficient manner.

Should he do such a thing again, since he's already been into trouble - he would be on an escalated punishment, perhaps even demotion - you're absolutely correct when you say it is unprofessional, but in this case the cold hard rules that have been used to outweigh, with other demotion requests it's the same, and the fact that outside of our servers - anyone is free just adds it all up.

So really, if you were looking for action - you got it. He's not getting anything more than what he got, because it's just stupid from both parties.

In response to your 'edit' - we will demote anyone who applies (under slacker conditions) or takes (instant demotes) a staff position at another community - This applies to ANY community, we are not discriminating against SD patrons. I can name one off the top of my head, MelvinVA.

You need to stop posting this now. This is your warning. Justice has been done, and if you're not satisfied - contact Agent or Zart. I would recommend talking to Zart VIA PM; Agent is currently on vacation.

If you have any other issues regarding what I have said, or you feel like talking to someone else - hit me up with a PM and we'll talk about it.

Other than that, it's a democracy - so let's see what others have to say, but it won't influence anything and will most likely just get out of hand.

I also agree with you that there should be no war between Zarp and SD but on the topic of the stuff that has been said by Cardigan I have no opinion in as I wish not to go into the depths of what seems was a very insulting piece of history which I am sure was dealt with accordingly.

Zart has already given his opinion. It's your choice to hold the grudge and seek sympathy where there's none to be found, because it's passed. If people feel that there is an issue with decisions made with regard to the abuse report - then they can talk to Zart or Agent, but until such communication is made - I've been dealt with. I stand by what I did, but it won't be happening again by Zart's orders - which I respect. As much as what I did has been deemed 'unprofessional' - I feel that you making the use of such a word is hypocritical. Let me remind you of this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8R-vxfr ... e=youtu.be

Sick move, friend.

I suggest that you stop posting these, as they're being seen as a disruption to the community - and you'll land yourself in trouble. You've had your justice - and if you don't agree with it, Chris has stated where you can go next with your complaint - but I don't see it going any further should you decide to do so. It is all the same evidence that you will produce as my actions will not be repeated.

Take the wise option.

Quit it.

DJSparky98 wrote:
It was dealt with.

I don't see his grounds to create so many threads - he put so much effort in and got justice. If he doesn't like Zart's decision, there's a process in which he can take; said process stated in my response.

Cardigan has already gotten a warning for his "verbal abuse". Considering the events, that is more than enough "punishment".

Ren, when are you going to stop trying, it's already over. This will be closed as the first thing next morning, just give up. This is not going to go any further. However, If you do continue, I'll talk to Zart about a forum ban.

Either; stop making more drama, or get forced to. Cardigan said some stuff, that I'm sure he did not mean, he was at his "boiling point".

End of story, that's it, there's nothing more to it. It wasn't serious enough for anything else.

Goodbye. Enjoy your time at SD.

Christopher wrote:
What wasn't? The picture of him verbally abusing on my profile? How was that no valid proof?

I agree, but as a staff member you're supposed to remain calm in the face of adversity, he did no such thing, even if I had provoked him adequately. Hewbiee said something similar to Scottie some time ago and he was about to be permabanned for it:
http://zarpgaming.com/http://zarpgaming ... ic.php?t=0

That's why I brought it here. Regardless, he is a staff member that behaved poorly in the presence of another staff member. (At the time, I wasn't demoted, and even if I was, I'm still a player).

http://i.imgur.com/wODhrw5.png?1?1716

Not to mention he said in the demotion request:
http://zarpgaming.com/http://zarpgaming ... 0#msg17790

I disagree. According to the guidelines posted by Agent that are the essential law in the community, he should have received far more that just a tier 1 warning:
http://zarpgaming.com/http://zarpgaming ... ic.php?t=8

I'm sure sexism applies there somewhere as well, referring to Sarah. Keep in mind it says "Any form of communication with players."


Which server? I'm on ZombieRP nearly every night. Just because he does his job well doesn't make him excluded from the rules, a single unprovoked mishap can cost a person everything. A great example is texting while driving just a single time, it can cause a person to get into a car crash and they could lose their life.

Once again, I disagree for the reasons above.

This is immature, you have to see that, right? And to my knowledge, Agent agrees with this as well:
[4/6/2013 6:04:00 PM] Ren: 5:34 PM - Agentlulz: We have permabanned people who accepted a staff position there
5:34 PM - Ren: Yes, but why?
5:34 PM - Ren: Isn't that a bit harsh?
5:35 PM - Ren: I accepted a staff position at SD, but I never wanted to turn my back on ZARP
5:36 PM - Ren: I've never started shit between SD and ZARP as well, I've remained fairly neutral, siding with whoever has evidence
5:36 PM - Agentlulz: - Your right.
5:36 PM - Agentlulz: - And stuff will be dealt with onc ei'm home

Believe it if you want, I suppose only time will tell.

I don't have to stop posting anything, this is my opinion. I'm a player of this community, and I'd like to know what you and others think. This is far from drama, this is an acute analysis of what others believe, if it was indeed shitposting, I would have just spammed hate all over the forums. I contacted Zart and apparently Cardigan has been poisoning his mind with me "betraying Zarp." Agent, as you said, is on vacation so he is not available.

A democracy? Cardigan was supposed to be judged by a party of unbiased peers. He was, instead, judged by several of his friends and affiliates that have fondness for him.

I respect your opinion, but you need to look at the facts.

An as an addition, this is far from over.

You don't tell someone to die and tell them they're a failure at life and their family is ashamed of them and get a warning from it, that's not how life is.

I'm entitled to what I want to say.
Xahenstraz wrote:
Feel free.

In addition, it appears that everyone's perception of drama is very slanted. I put this in Gen. Disc. because this is an open thread discussing something that happened. By some people's definition of drama, we should get rid of ban request because it causes drama among players and staff.

Far from over? We've already talked to Zart, this'll be closed next morning.

The main problem here is; that you are trying to get someone banned/demoted, because of hurt feelings, and that's just not how it works.

I'm not going to reply too much to this thread, as I've kinda stopped caring. This may be my last post on all of the hundreds of posts you're gonna make. I'm not going to overkill an already won battle, so I'll stop here.

Peace out.

Xahenstraz wrote:
No, I'm trying to get someone demoted because they insulted me, my dignity, my friends, and is a genuinely inhumane individual to begin with, and as I said, this battle is not over.

I am deeply offended, and I am a player. Cardigan is not an adequate staff member for Zarp.

Okay, I'm sick of you holding this up.

I'm going to sleep soon, so I'm just going to finish off with this final argument which has been raised before:

Anyone can forge that by editing their steam profile, or just changing some text. It can not be proven that it is him, even if he confesses - in the real world, if someone confessed, it doesn't solve the case. So really, the proof is invalid - and you're lucky that it was assumed it was him, and he was given sufficient punishment.

You may think I'm stupid for saying this, but it's the truth. Proof isn't valid - could have been faked, as it's an easy target - especially when it is perceived as irrelevant to this community.

You've actuated punishment and you have no motive to continue upon, if you're unhappy with the punishment given - converse with Zart VIA forum PM. Otherwise, this is DRAMA. Many of your threads have been closed, and since the issue is dealt with - further communication can be done privately.

I'm close to locking this for the very reason that Agent wants drama OUT. Talk to Zart if you have further concerns, but here I will not be responding to any further arguments from you unless privately.
Ren wrote:
Underlining might make your argument visually appeasing, but it doesn't make it any more true. Your request was closed, get out of the GD forum and make another report if you're so worried and disgusted about this fantastic admin and colleague. Taking it public will not help your case. As much as there's a democratic environment - the decisions are ultimately made by different people, and by no means is it a 'vote'.

Stop your campaigning and protest. Take it to the report forums, or PM Zart.

Christopher wrote:
Locking this thread is abuse, not everybody has had their input.

I won't even begin to tell you what a sad defense you're offering to Cardigan.

Ren, could you please stop making post about this. It has been taken care of personally by Zart. If you have a problem with the course that has been taken then you should talk to either Agent or Zart. Please don't make post about it because you might just receive more hate.

Prophet wrote:
I don't care if people like me, I care that the community gets what is best for it.

Regardless, I'm done here. You are all too blinded by Cardigan's lies and slander rather than my factual proof to have a valid opinion.

Ren wrote:
I decided to make another post, since you just don't get it.

It is over, tomorrow, this thread is gonna get shut down, and you'll probably be forum banned (if you don't stop posting). Afterwards, what are you going to do? If you keep posting, you'll get banned. If you use a VPN and a fake account, nobody will listen to you, and your threads will be deleted.

Get it? It's over.

From now on, I don't care whether you post back with: "It isn't over", I'm not gonna reply. Making that commment made me realize: that you're not gonna give up. So therefor, I've completely stopped caring.

Bye.