TOPIC: Tyler My G

Tyler has done a fantastic job this year and not only has dedicated a huge amount of time and effort to this community but has also gone out of his way to personally help me and others in the community with real issues too which I can't thank him enough for.

Chuteuk wrote: this doesn't mean he isn't corrupt and this is a huge fuck you to a (supposedly) democratic community

Not only does he help with all the issues in the servers, he also helps people emotionally. I've never met a better listener than Noah. And while the ex-community developer was neglecting our wishes for the server in the coding, Noah helped. Talk shit as much as you want, but what Para did was wrong, and has shocked most of us. Noah is am amazing CM, and will continue doing amazing things for everyone.

Always gonna love Tyler

To those so willing to attack and condemn Tyler in light of the little bits of conversation provided in the other thread, how about you slow the fuck down and give Tyler the benefit of the doubt before you trash him? The dude's done insane work for all of Zarp, feel the least he deserves is a chance to gather himself and give a reply. The fucking speed in which some of you are so willing to jump on the next target is embarrassing and disgusting. Put your pitchforks away for the night and relax. The current CM team has shown a willingness to correct mistakes as demonstrated earlier, give them some time to go over it as well.

ChummyXRay wrote:
I honestly think Tyler is at fault too, but this guy is right. Give the dude some space. This was a very difficult situation, and the easiest option was just to say nothing, which I completely understand because I've done the same in situations like these multiple time.

sorle wrote:
Everyone thinks they'll be a hero and do what is right when the time calls for it. People do this because it is incredibly easy to put oneself on a pedestal in hypothetic scenarios, but when faced with reality the majority of us will always go the safest route. It is fine to be upset with those that do as such, even if you are one that might do the same as them. It is not okay to rile yourself and others into a caustic fit over a brief insight into an obviously deep and complicated issue. The people so willing to jump down another's throat while lacking any sort of real context are the same idiots that feel the need to be out in front of something ahead of time just to say "i told you so." Putting yourself into a corner so early doesn't gain you brownie points when the truth comes out. All it does is show you're a person unwilling to fully commit to seeing a problem through from start to finish before making extreme public judgement.

I'm not saying Tyler is in the right, but the last thing I'm going to do is condemn him and demand a form of punishment when I have almost no idea what fully happened. There are people above me who are much more aware of the finer details that are yet to voice an opinion and act on it, meaning this isn't nearly as simple as some would like to believe. I normally avoid callouts, but this is at you, Ace. I respect you, but your outspoken anger and vitriol towards Tyler when you know just as much as the rest of us is ignorant and telling.

ChummyXRay wrote: To be fair, I wanted to call out Ace too - not because of any underlining hatred between us two (as far as I'm aware, there was none), but because of the fact that he isn't joining the bandwagon of hate against Tyler, he's fucking leading it.

The CM team could just as easily have said "Fuck it" and not made the thread about Para's situation. They could have CM banned Para and kept it at that, or they could have just allow Para to resign and leave the community and only discuss the issue behind the scenes. Instead they made a relatively in-depth post that explains a lot of what has happened, possibly everything (that's the thing - when you're not investigating the issue yourself you can have no clue to how much of the post is missing out on) and that even describes the possibility of an ex-owner being involved as well.

What I'm trying to say is: the CM team are not obligated to tell us anything, no matter how much the community might believe in "democracy" and "transparency". The fact that they have in fact told us the story and decided to say that Tyler is not involved doesn't mean that the CM team is trying to cover it up, it means that the situation is extremely complicated and Tyler was most likely pressured into not telling anyone of what actually happened. When a person of extremely high power with very sensitive information threatens you, you might not feel as inclined to tell the truth as some people might think, even if you are entirely innocent and willing to tell the truth. Also, don't forget that it was in the end Tyler who came out with the fact that this has all happened. And that's a lot more heroic than these idiots trying to demand something based on a situation they barely know anything about.

Is Tyler at fault? I don't know. Considering his continuous hard work for the community, I'd say he isn't, however that doesn't matter. What matters is that all of you deciding to judge Tyler even though you owe the CM team for telling you this story in the first place and then refuse to believe it when they also tell you the small detail about how another CM is not in fact at fault just shows how narrow minded you actually are.

@Raeker @Chummy

Thing is you guys reference what would happen "in reality" but we all know that in reality Tyler would be punished for his poor choices, regardless of his hard work he participated in the same thing Para did so if you use that excuse for Tyler then you should use it for Para aswell since it's the same situation and they both did great work. I'll say it once again that it has been stated that the only "blackmail" towards Tyler was the threat of Para exposing his own voter fraud and I've also explained how ludacrius this is if Tyler had actually done the right thing from the start this whole issue would not be happening.

On top of this complaining about people making judgements without the full story is also pretty absurd as it is not the community's fault for it but actually the CM team's fault for not giving us the full story which forces the community to make judgements prior to having all the information and I really doubt Tyler is so unreachable that he is able to give away all this information but not post on the situation himself.

On top of this if a small group of literally 2 people say that someone is not at fault and let's say 30-40 people say that the same person is at fault with the same story then clearly the 2 people are incorrect in the situation. It's not ignorance it's an evaluation of the situation we have been told about, if we aren't told everything we can't evaluate everything and the attitude that the CM team is not obligated to tell us anything at all is what causes people to preemptively judge the situation as there is no guarantee of them getting more information as you said yourself.

So really Ace and the other members of the community who have voiced any opinion that isn't licking Tyler's arse and making him out to be a victim are not "jumping on a hate bandwagon" or "leading it" they are simply voicing their opinions based on the information given to us and once again it's not irrational at all to do it so early as no guarantee has been given to them that any more information will be revealed either way.

P.S. when you really think about it the CM team consists of Tyler, EMP and Chute at the moment and Tyler's position is being questioned by many community members so really the only opinions that matter in this situation are EMP and Chute's and EMP has voiced no such opinion so far. My point is at the moment we are taking Chute's opinion of the situation as the correct one to have but Chute is only human so there is bound to be a lot of bias in this decision due to them being friends/colleagues for so long and Tyler doing a good job. Just bare that in mind.

dankek wrote: You get incompetent swines in any democracy.

At the end of the day Tyler was blackmailed and was forced not to say anything and all you people on the hate bandwagon saying blackmail isn't that bad, just remember you weren't in his situation he has worked day in day out for this community and if he said anything about the issue he could of been cm banned and since working so hard imagine all the work he has don for this community, not just this year but since he has been here, just locked away from him.

RealDenis wrote: THIS DUDE IS SO HARD TO
DISAGREE WITH WTF 200IQ

Not sure why you bothered to comment when you completely missed our points and created your own points to argue. Pc is off so I'm gonna try to keep it short.

Tyler would/will be punished if he is found at fault. I said people should reserve judgement till they know more. I didn't excuse him because of his work. I'm saying his work should earn him a chance to defend himself before being blasted.

It doesn't force anyone to make judgements. No one has to do so. Even less reason to do so when we lack the rest of the details. No one is holding a gun to anyone's head and demanding their input. People are choosing to do so and painting themselves ignorant in the process. If you want to pop off half cocked, that's your choice.

Again, people choose to judge. The same attitude that because we don't know we're forced to decide is exactly what you're condemning us for. We are saying people should be patient, you are saying they can't be because they don't know. Majority isn't always right either. Just because more people share a similar story doesn't suddenly make their interpretation right.

No. Ace is publicly condemning Tyler and encouraging punishment with essentially zero context and evidence. "We don't know if we'll know more so it's okay to leap to conclusions." That's essentially what you're saying.

Not taking anyone's side. I'm arguing to not take such a rigid stand for either until more is known. You're the one siding with those rushing judgement.

.

You becoming CM was the right choice! Det som är det mest "disturbing" var något han sa till mig. Nu när jag tänker på det så erkände Para till mig att han blackmaila dig och skit. Vi var i en spacer när jag ägde Murder och snackade med honom. Då sa han något sånthär (kommer inte ihåg de exakta orden men) han sa typ "Tyler gör vad jag vill, för att han vet att den ända anledningen han fick CM var på grund av mig. Tyler är i grund och botten min bitch". Ta inte det jag säger som fakta för att jag kommer inte ihåg det så väl och jag spelar inte in ts. Men det är riktigt jävla disturburbing nu när jag tänker på det.

RealDenis wrote: Sorry bud, but you're just being stupid at this point.

Reality? I'm not talking about reality, I'm talking about the community. And from a community perspective Tyler would not be punished. Also, which poor choices are you hinting at exactly?

You don't know that, you're assuming that. All of the Lead Team were moved into a spacer when Para got CM banned, and it was emphasised that Tyler had nothing to do with the fraud and he was being blackmailed all year. You're assuming that there were plenty of opportunities for Tyler to come out with the truth, but you don't know if that's actually the case. I don't believe that it's as simple as you're making it out to be.

"It's the CM team's fault for not giving us the full story" sorry man, but are you stupid? They've told us everything we have to know, including the fact that Tyler is completely innocent. We don't know if they haven't told us everything, something I actually said earlier myself, so you're once again making assumptions without facts to back it up. The fact that you're completely acceptant of everything that's happened except for one person being innocent says quite a lot about what information you like to take in.

Also, Tyler is on holiday currently. I do believe he will respond to this situation in due time, however don't forget that this is actually a difficult thing for him as well. Regardless of Para blackmailing him, they were still very good friends. I find it completely understandable if he'd rather keep low about the situation. He does not owe you any kind of an explanation, no matter how much you might believe he does.

Except that the people who say that the person is at fault have literally nothing to do with the situation. The CM team has investigated the issue and have spoken to both Para as well as Tyler about it (something that cannot be said for the judgemental opinions of those on the forums) and have come to the conclusion that Tyler is not at fault. Saying that Tyler is at fault because some people on the forums said so is just plain wrong. I'd rather believe a correct minority that has knowledge about the situation than an incorrect majority that is complaining without anything to back up their opinions.
You're once again assuming that the CM team owes you anything, but they don't. They might represent the community but that does not mean they have to tell the community everything. You're saying that you will make your own judgements because they don't tell you everything, but what if there's nothing more to tell? Tyler has been blackmailed throughout the whole year and from that it's been decided that he is completely innocent. You shouldn't have to need all the available information given to you to be able to trust someone's word. The fact that they've said that Tyler is innocent should be enough in its own right.

It is actually irrational, because Tyler has been said to be innocent. You're looking at the proof provided to you and going "Well, that's wrong" instead of believing in the CM team, even though you do believe in the CM team about the rest of the story. It's like you're picking and choosing what of the story to believe.

Not sure why you're leaving Captin and Max out of this.
It's questioned based on facts and accusations that have been proven wrong or are based on factless arguments.
No, the opinion that matters is that of the CM team that has investigated the issue. And they have found Tyler to be innocent.
As stated by the post, the ones mostly involved were Captin, Max and Chute. Tyler said his opinion but did not actually investigate the issue. EMP is not directly involved which is exactly why he hasn't made his opinion known.
Para did a good job, too, so to say that the CM team's decision is influenced by Tyler's performances the past year is invalid when he got CM banned. In the end, it's the CM team's opinion that matters, not one opinion of a single person. You're basing your statement on invalid and baseless arguments so before judging Tyler I'd advice you to not come onto a post such as this one and shout such complete bullshit.

Do you guys even read my posts and the original post before responding like wtf

RealDenis wrote: If your argument against ours is the fact that we "haven't read your post" then you've pretty much lost the debate. We read what you have to say but what you're saying is that Tyler should be demoted even though you don't have any proof to back up such a claim, which is basically rushing to conclusions and judging Tyler for things he hasn't actually done.

I'd rather you'd go more in-depth into our posts like how we have gone into yours and tell us which of our arguments are wrong rather than accusing us of things we haven't done. It's actually kinda funny how you're doing the exact same to Tyler.

Tyler should not be CM anymore tbh. rigged polls fuck me.

Raeker wrote: What I'm saying is that the points you and Chummy made in your recent posts have already had counter arguments made in my previous posts and even the original announcement about Para's demotion and CM ban. That's why I'm asking if you actually read all my posts and the original. I'm gonna take your advice though and stop arguing until we get more information.

To clear some of this up, I did not partake in the voting and the votes were placed prior to me being informed. I was told that I was not in place to tell anyone due to what it would mean for me and others as well as the community as a whole. I was placed under a great deal of distress finding out that someone who was very close to me had taken part in something that not only created trouble for them but for me too. I was told that I was never supposed be informed of what had been going on and that I need to keep shut about any knowledge even to those who knew.

At first I was only informed that the votes had been visible to forum administrators and that I was apparently catching up. I was then told not to mention this to anyone in order to avoid complications with the vote but that the owners knew and were patching it. It later turned out that Chute and EMP were not yet aware regardless of what I'd heard.

Later I was finally informed of what had happened with the votes and told that whilst we'd gained some votes via our campaign that it hadn't been enough and that votes had been forged and that the current votes had been leaked regardless of efforts by Chute and EMP to stop them from being leaked.

Whilst being informed Para said I couldn't say anything at all as he wasn't supposed to tell me about it. I was also repeatedly told "Please remember this is being done for you, because we're friends" and "We all know what would happen to the community without this". These things made me extremely anxious, worried and left me feeling preassure to the point of me suffering the consequences in my daily life in the form of anxiety due to me being in the place of either betraying two friends and risking dealing a massive blow to the community as I was told I would if I was to say anything.

Finally, I'd like to say that ultimately I was the only one of the people who knew that came out on my own and reported what had happened even if it took a lot to push me to do it. I also said at several points that I would be fine or happy to have it all published as it ended up being.

As I've said to others I am at fault of not saying anything out of fear for what would happen just not in the way you have thought.

I'd like to give thanks to the rest CM team for their help in further investigating this situation after my report.

I'd also like to give a special thanks to Sarah, Chummy and Doombringer for supporting and helping me. I love you all, even though Doombringer might be evil incarnate