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TOPIC: Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence.

Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183079

Hi there!

So, some of you may not know who I am, my name is Gems and I have been a staff member on ZARP for about 9 months at this point, so I would say that I have a decent amount of experience. I'm making this "guide" because i have seen a lot of staff members out there, simply showing up to an F1, asking for evidence and if there is none they will simply move on. If you think this is all you can do, then you are wrong! So today I will try to teach you some of the tricks I use, to get a player to admit to whatever he may have done.

I do realize that this guide may sort of work as a double-edged sword, since a player looking to break the rules could use this knowledge to their advantage, but then again, most of the people who are active on the forums cares about the server and wouldn't break any rules. Lets get started!

Step 1: Approaching the request
It is extremely important that you give a good first impression to the player once you show up for his request, make sure he isn't busy by teleporting to him first, or using spectate if you have reached admin. Sending him a message asking if he has a moment and waiting for him to reply is always a good idea, it means a lot to the player, since that way he won't be confused and unaware about whats going on.

Step 2: Hearing him out
At first, if the person is frustrated it is important that you calm him down, tell him you will sort things out, try to make him laugh if possible, don't get mad at him for being mad, it will only make things worse and even if you don't agree with his point of view, tell him that you understand why hes frustrated, it will make him trust you.

Next up it is extremely important that you have him explain what happened in details, you need to understand what happened and if you don't get it the first time make sure you ask again, it is so important that you understand what went on.
a lot of F1s will actually be solved at this point, since you will realize that the situation he is describing does not actually contain a rulebreak, in that case simply explain to him why and how it isn't against the rules.

Step 3: Approaching the rulebreaker.

player y = victim, player x = potential rulebreaker

Now comes the hard part, by overlooking player y's explanation, and reading the logs you will 99 percent of the time be able to create a raw picture of what happened, example:

player y explains how player x broke NLR, to raid his base at the warehouse district on server 1. You check the logs and find player x dying to player y 5 times, before finally killing him, all within 3 minutes.

Now taking the amount of time it would take player x to run back to the warehouse district, which is rather far from spawn we could assume that player y is telling the truth and at the least 90 percent of the times we would be correct, plus in the logs, it will tell you what district player x and player y has died in.

Another example:

Player y accuses player x of RDMing him, you check the logs and see that player x has killed player y once, however you have rarely or never seen player y on the server, he is playing as a black market dealer and he overall seems inexperienced.

In this scenario we cant assume anything, I would give player y about a 40% chance of being right.

Now keep in mind that a high percentage is far from enough, you need to be 100 percent sure. But it will help us on how to approach the rulebreaker.

Once you as a staff member have created your picture of the situation it is time to bring the rulebreaker in, you approach just like you would approach the victim, shown above. It is just as important that you get his whole story as well, it may be completely different from the first one, but mostly it will be around the same, with a few tweaks, make sure you ask in a lot and that you take notes of how easily and quickly he is responding, if he is lying he will have trouble making up the story, and he might slip, but if hes telling the truth he wont have any troubles answering any of your questions. Make sure you never reveal what is in your logs to the players, since that is an easy way to catch them lying.

At this point the majority of the rulebreaks will be solved, but if you are still not sure, you can use some of these methods:

Method 1: Point things out
It is highly likely that you have noticed some things or flaws that seemed suspicious during the above points, reveal them all to him in a very dominant manner, make it sound like you really are on to him, if the victim has broken the rule he will often become scared enough to just admit to what hes done at this point, thinking hes really made you mad.

Method 2: Baiting / Threatening
This one is simple, just remind him of the punishments that are for said rulebreak, tell him that RDMing someone is bad, but lying about it could get him worse, a lot of rulebreakers will crack using this, thinking the risk isn't worth the reward.

Method 3: Lying (Careful!)
Now of course being honest is extremely important as a staff member, but there are certain situations where a white lie can be useful. For this method you simply tell the victim to let you do the talking before you teleport the rulebreaker, you can then later confront the rulebreaker saying that you have evidence of the rulebreak, even though you don't! Next off the rulebreaker will do one of two things; Admit to everything, or start screaming abuse! Because of this you wanna be quite sure about your case before using this method. You can push it as far as you want, but make sure that an innocent user knows that you where lying by the end of the F1.

Using the information above i am able to handle at the least 95% Of all F1s without evidence. Assuming the accused is not afk.

Make sure you always seem neutral and respectful as a start out, but faking temper can without a doubt be helpful, as well as being friendly and understanding. Just make sure you always use common sense and that you back out if you start feeling like the accused really is innocent.

It is highly likely that i have left something out, or made a bunch of typos, feel free to correct me on those and if you have any questions please let me know! If any staff members have tricks that weren't shown here, then write them in below! If you have any criticism or if you would just like to tell me that I'm an idiot then go ahead, but make sure you bring arguments.

Thanks for reading my short guide!
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Last Edit: 7 years 1 month ago by Clarky. Reason: Fixed grammar/misspells + added some information!
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183086

Thank you so much. I know I'm not staff but if I ever do become staff this will help me a lot

Please make this a official guide


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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183095

This is good.
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183097

Wait staff aren't doing this?
Shit we need to spend more time training them.
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183104

Nice guide. This should be included in that handbook given to new moderators. ^-^
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183127

Very helpful , GJ Gems.
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183158

This looks good Gems, nice job buddy! its extremly useful!
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183160

I used to do most of these, and it's fun playing detective instead of asking for evidence and leave.

I especially like saying i have evidence beacuse they always admit for that :)
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183162

[SSRP] Meeting Outcome

SSRP Lead Team Meeting
We have demoted a few staff members, We have also edited a rule, And promoted a admin to super admin congrats to Gems we are pleased with his work on the server and hope he can help the server even more with his new position on the staff team
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183166

Walter wrote:
[SSRP] Meeting Outcome

SSRP Lead Team Meeting
We have demoted a few staff members, We have also edited a rule, And promoted a admin to super admin congrats to Gems we are pleased with his work on the server and hope he can help the server even more with his new position on the staff team
If gems can keep his activity up of course. He's an amazing member of staff.
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183168

As good as this guide is its useless because any staff worth their rank knows this.
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183318

Kristofferson wrote:
Wait staff aren't doing this?
Shit we need to spend more time training them.

When i got traied you showed me all things like how things work but never how to do F1's

I believe you should do 5-6 F1's so the mods know how to execute them.
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183325

Guide to the rule breaker:
RDMed someone? got reported?
First thing you should do is ask for evidence, if there is no evidence just say a nice story.
"He shot me first, idk why, so I killed him", oh, and to make the admins believe your story just say "CHECK THE DAMAGE LOGS! YOU CAN SEE HE SHOT ME!", there are no damage logs obviously, so you'll just get away without a warning.
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183326

Gems wrote:
Hi there!

So, some of you may not know who i am, my name is Gems and i have been a staff member on zarp for about 9 months at this point, so i would say that i have a decent amount of experience. Im making this "guide" because i have seen alot of staff members out there, simply showing up to an F1, asking for evidence and if there is none they will simply move on. If you think this is all you can do, then you are wrong! So today i will try to teach you some of the tricks i use, to get a player to admit to
whatever he may have done.

I do realise that this guide may sort of work as a double-edged sword, since a player looking to break the rules could use this knowledge to their advantage, but then again, most of the people who are active on the forums cares about the server and wouldnt break any rules. Lets get started!

Step 1: Approaching the request
It is extremely important that you give a good first impression to the player once you show up for his request, make sure he isnt busy by teleporting to him first, or using spectate if you have reached admin. Sending him a message asking if he has a moment and waiting for him to reply is always a good idea, it means alot to the player, since that way he wont be confused and unaware about whats going on.

Step 2: Hearing him out
At first, if the person is frustrated it is important that you calm him down, tell him you will sort things out, try to make him laugh if possible, dont get mad at him for being mad, it will only make things worse and even if you dont agree with his point of view, tell him that you understand why hes frustrated, it will make him trust you.

Next up it is extremely important that you have him explain what happended in details, you need to understand what happended and if you dont get it the first time make sure you ask again, it is so important that you understand what went on.
alot of F1s will actually be solved at this point, since you will realise that the situation he is describing does not actually contain a rulebreak, in that case simply explain to him why and how it isnt againts the rules.

Step 3: Approaching the rulebreaker.

<em>player y = victim, player x = potential rulebreaker</em>

Now comes the hard part, by overlooking player y's explanation, and reading the logs you will 99 percent of the time be able to create a raw picture of what happened, example:

<em>player y explains how player x broke nlr, to raid his base at the warehouse district on server 1. You check the logs and find player x dying to player y 5 times, before finally killing him, all within 3 minutes.</em>

Now taking the amount of time it would take player x to run back to the warehouse district, which is rather far from spawn we could assume that player y is telling the truth and at the least 90 percent of the times we would be correct.

Another example:

<em>Player y accuses player x of rdming him, you check the logs and see that player x has killed player y once, however you have rarely or never seen player y on the server, he is playing as a black market dealer and he overall seems inexperienced.
</em>
In this scenario we cant assume anything, i would give player y about a 40% chance of being right.

Now keep in mind that a high percentage is far from enough, you need to be 100 percent sure. But it will help us on how to approach the rulebreaker.

Once you as a staff member have created your picture of the situation it is time to bring the rulebreaker in, you approach just like you would approach the victim, shown above. It is just as important that you get his whole story aswell, it may be completely diffrent from the first one, but mostly it will be around the same, with a few tweaks, make sure you ask in alot and that you take notes of how easily and quickly he is responding, if he is lying he will have trouble making up the story, and he might slip, but if hes telling the truth he wont have any troubles answering any of your questions. Make sure you never reveal what is in your logs to the players, since that is an easy way to catch them lying.

At this point the majority of the rulebreaks will be solved, but if you are still not sure, you can use some of these methods:

Method 1: Point things out
It is highly likely that you have noticed some things or flaws that seemed suspicious during the above points, reveal them all to him in a very dominant manner, make it sound like you really are on to him, if the victim has broken the rule he will often become scared enough to just admit to what hes done at this point, thinking hes really made you mad.

Method 2: Baiting / Threatening
This one is simple, just remind him of the punishments that are for said rulebreak, tell him that rdming someone is bad, but lying about it could get him worse, alot of rulebreakers will crack using this, thinking the risk isnt worth the reward.

Method 3: Lying (Careful!)
Now ofcourse being honest is extremely important as a staff member, but there are certain situations where a white lie can be useful. For this method you simply tell the victim to let you do the talking before you teleport the rulebreaker, you can then later confront the rulebreaker saying that you have evidence of the rulebreak, even though you dont! Next off the rulebreaker will do one of two things; Admit to everything, or start screaming abuse! Because of this you wanna be quite sure about your case before using this method. You can push it as far as you want, but make sure that an innocent user knows that you where lying by the end of the F1.

Using the information above i am able to handle at the least 95% Of all F1s without evidence. Assuming the accused is not afk.

Make sure you always seem neutral and respectful as a startout, but faking temper can without a doubt be helpful, aswell as being friendly and understanding. Just make sure you always use common sense and that you back out if you start feeling like the accused really is innocent.

It is highly likely that i have left something out, or made a bunch of typos, feel free to correct me on those and if you have any questions please let me know! If any staff members have tricks that weren't shown here, then write them in below! If you have any criticism or if you would just like to tell me that im an idiot then go ahead, but make sure you bring arguments.

Thanks for reading my short guide!


I'm a new mod so this will help me loads thank you .
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Last Edit: 8 years 7 months ago by Lord of Banterbury.
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183361

What Lying how trustworthy can a member of staff be?
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183362

Zaxerino wrote:
What Lying how trustworthy can a member of staff be?

Lying to convince the accused person to pretend you know the truth? Nothing wrong about that
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #183407

Great guide Gems, perhaps who ever accepts applications and replies on them should link this in their reply.
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #184969

People should keep in mind that the accused person should still be treated with respect, even if someone did wrong they shouldn't be thrown to the trash or be treated in a way that could make them feel bad.
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #184982

John Jackson wrote:
As good as this guide is its useless because any staff worth their rank knows this.

unfortunately, how i see it. Right now there is a lot of staff-members not worth their Rank at all.

If you look over the forums and see this staff guide and the retrain that was happening u know shit was going on.
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Staff guide - Completing F1s without evidence. 8 years 7 months ago #186500

Really well made i hope this helps some staff since when i was on last time i got rdm 6 times by a group of 2 people and they just said "Do you have evidence that i rdm you?"The mod just let this case go and before the 6th time somebody was spectating me and finally caught them on the act.They just kept saying before that i kept pulling my gun at them but in reality as soon as i came back to my gunshop i was dead and even after all that they came up with the worst lie " My friend has the evidence has he just went to the toilet for 2 house he will show it later" {-- he want afk as the admin came. In the end they got a verball warning for lying 2 times and rdming 5/1 each.



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